Jay Shetty & Dr. Rahul Jandial ON What Your Nightmares Are Trying to Tell You

In this On Purpose episode, Jay Shetty interviews Dr. Rahul Jandial, a brain surgeon and neuroscientist, about the significance of dreaming.

Dr. Jandial explains the active role dreaming plays in processing our experiences, emotions, and sparking creativity.

They explore the significance of common dream themes, including nightmares and erotic dreams, and the science behind lucid dreaming. Dr. Jandial also shares practical insights on enhancing dream recall, inducing lucid dreams, using dreams for problem-solving, improving children's sleep, and establishing positive morning routines to boost mental and emotional well-being.

Sleep Is Vital for the Brain

Dr. Jandial explained to Jay Shetty that dreaming occupies about one-third of our lives and plays a vital role in brain function. He describes dreams as a form of "high-intensity training" for the brain, which keeps it active and preserves neural functions that might otherwise weaken. When dreaming, the brain's logical functions are dampened, while imagination and emotions are heightened. This shift helps explain why dreams are often vivid and emotional yet lack logical structure.

Dr. Jandial also mentions  that certain types of dreams, like nightmares and erotic dreams, are nearly universal. Dreams may serve different purposes, such as emotional processing or sparking creativity. While individual dreams are unique, studying large numbers of dreams can reveal important insights about the brain's activity during sleep.

"Dreaming Is Our Shepherd"

Jay Shetty notes that people often feel their struggles are unique, but dream patterns reveal that many face similar issues. Dr. Jandial explains that studies show dreams can mirror our emotional states, such as women going through divorce who dreamt of reconciliation recovering better, while those with troubled dreams experienced longer depression.

Dr. Jandial emphasizes that the dreaming brain processes emotional stress and can offer valuable insights into well-being. He suggests that certain dreams, especially highly emotional or visual ones, act as a guide or "shepherd," helping us navigate our emotions. Additionally, he notes that dreams can be cultivated and are not merely passive experiences - they allow us to actively engage with their dream life.

Sleep Entry

Dr. Jandial highlights to Jay Shetty the importance of engaging with our dream life, particularly during the "sleep entry" phase. Sleep entry is a brief period between wakefulness and sleep where creativity and divergent thinking are heightened. He references historical figures like Salvador Dali and Thomas Edison, who used this phase to capture innovative ideas. Dr. Jandial suggests that journaling or focusing on specific thoughts before sleep can influence dreams and lead to creative breakthroughs.

Dr. Jandial told Jay Shetty that using a phone immediately upon waking can disrupt memory retention of dreams, making it harder to reflect on them. Instead, he suggests journaling as soon as you wake up to preserve and engage with dreams - this way, it can become a tool for problem-solving and emotional processing.

Pay Attention to Your Dreams

Jay Shetty explores the topic of erotic dreams, noting that actions like masturbation or pornography are not necessarily what fuels them but rather our secret fantasies and desires. Dr. Jandial explains that erotic dreams are more connected to what individuals fantasize about during the day rather than their actual activities. This aligns with the concept of the dreaming brain as a liberated space where imagination is at its peak.

Even people in happy relationships may experience dreams involving infidelity. Dr. Jandial points out that while there's no definitive answer, erotic dreams often reflect our hidden desires, not necessarily our reality. Dreams serve as a symbolic expression of emotions and personal thoughts, as opposed to a direct reflection of waking desires.

High-emotional dreams serve as invitations to reflect on our lives. Dr. Jandial explained to Jay Shetty that we shouldn't ignore our dreams because they can offer valuable insight into our emotional states. These dreams, filled with metaphor and symbolism, encourage us to explore our feelings more deeply.

Different Types of Dreams

Jay Shetty and Dr. Jandial discuss the nature of recurring dreams and how they originate from the brain's electrical activity. Dr. Jandial explains that recurrent dreams are loops of electrical signals within specific brain regions, which can be activated even during brain surgery. He categorizes dreams into recurrent, universal, and rare types, each with unique characteristics.

Dr. Jandial explained to Jay Shetty that, through Imagery Rehearsal Therapy (IRT), you can consciously re-script your nightmares before sleep and achieve more positive dream outcomes. He emphasizes that dreams are not random glitches but are driven by underlying brain processes.

It is essential to intentionality and actively engage in our mental processes, especially how our daily activities influence our dreams. Jay Shetty shares an experience during the pandemic when watching the TV show Ozark led him to have recurring nightmares about his house being broken into. Dr. Jandial agrees that dreams often reflect our waking life stresses, though they remain symbolic and not always straightforward.

Moreover, he mentions how the arrival of color television led to an increase in people reporting colored dreams. So, there seems to be a deep connection between media consumption and dream content. According to Dr. Jandial, dreams are actively driven by brain processes and offer insights that our waking mind might not access.

Nightmares Are Useful

Children experience five times as many nightmares as adults, a fact that can be unnerving for parents.1 Dr. Jandial explains that nightmares in children play a crucial role in their cognitive development and are not simply a random occurrence. He suggests that nightmares help children develop a sense of self versus others, as well as the ability to differentiate between waking life and dreams.

This developmental phase coincides with other significant cognitive milestones, such as the development of visual-spatial skills and theory of mind. Most children outgrow their nightmares. Dr. Jandial emphasizes that nightmares are part of a natural and necessary process that helps cultivate a child's mind. While uncertainty in dreams can be unsettling, it is also essential for creativity and adaptability.

Sleep Exit

Opposite to sleep entry, during sleep exit, the brain's executive network gradually reactivates. Dr. Jandial explains to Jay Shetty that this process can push dream memories to the background, especially if you quickly check your phone upon waking. If you want to remember your dreams better, Dr. Jandial suggests lingering in this state, resisting the urge to jump into daily activities immediately.

This practice can help you retain the insights and creative ideas that emerge during sleep. Dr. Jandial also highlights that sleep entry and exit are distinct, measurable brain states with patterns that differ from those of waking or dreaming, typically lasting between two to twelve minutes.

Dreams Can Predict the Future

Dr. Jandial shared with Jay Shetty that tech companies are already exploring ways to influence dreams, such as through sounds or scents, and potentially using AI to analyze and manipulate dream content. However, he warns that while this could be beneficial, it also raises concerns about privacy and the commercialization of our dream lives.

While most dreams are symbolic and not literal, some can predict health issues. Dr. Jandial shared with Jay Shetty a specific connection between REM behavior disorder and the early onset of Parkinson's disease, with 94% of those affected developing the condition within 15 years.2 This is one of the few scientifically supported cases where dreams can predict future health issues.

Symbolic Dreams

Dr. Jandial explains to Jay Shetty that some dreams, such as PTSD flashbacks, accurately replay real events. However, most dreams are a mix of memories and imagination, creating vivid, movie-like experiences. He emphasizes that the dreaming mind operates uniquely, potentially accessing memories in ways our waking mind cannot.

For example, some people can slip back into a dream after briefly waking up, or those with amnesia might remember dreams they can't recall while awake. This fascinating capability of the dreaming mind has inspired Dr. Jandial to see dreams as a powerful and mysterious aspect of the brain. He describes his exploration of dreams as a rebirth in his understanding of the mind, revealing new connections between the brain and our dream life.

Lucid Dreaming

Lucid dreaming refers to being aware you are dreaming while still in the dream. Dr. Jandial explains to Jay Shetty that lucid dreaming is scientifically validated, with evidence from brain scans and experiments showing that people can communicate with the outside world through eye movements while still asleep. He highlights that lucid dreaming involves a mix of wakefulness and dreaming, with some brain areas, like the frontal cortex, partially reactivating during these dreams.

Lucid dreaming is common, with 30-40% of people reporting it, especially among athletes, gamers, and creatives. For beginners interested in trying lucid dreaming, Dr. Jandial recommends the Mnemonic Induction of Lucid Dreams (MILD) technique3, which involves waking up slightly earlier and consciously drifting back to sleep. This method has been scientifically tested and it demonstrated that lucid dreaming can be induced and controlled, a fascinating intersection between consciousness and sleep.

Potential Meanings

Jay Shetty reflects on the common questions people ask about their dreams, such as their meaning or reality, and wonders if these are the right questions. Dr. Jandial suggests concentrating on the hyper-emotional dreams that linger into the next day. These dreams often stem from the brain's emotional systems, which are more active during sleep than in waking life.

Dr. Jandial advises the listeners to reflect on these emotionally charged dreams because they can provide insights into your deeper feelings and experiences. Do not neglect these dreams, as they may reveal important aspects of your inner life.

The Dreaming Brain Is Your Ally

Dr. Jandial shares with Jay Shetty the importance of resilience - our dreaming brain acts as an ally, helping us navigate challenges by cultivating resilience. He introduces the concepts of systemic and processive resilience—the first one being what we bring to challenges, and the other what challenges bring out in us.

Dr. Jandial also reflects on his journey as a brain surgeon; he admitted that exploring dreams has broadened his understanding, even challenging his expertise. He shared with Jay Shetty that the dreaming mind can sometimes access the body more fluidly than the waking mind, a mysterious and powerful potential of dreams.

The Importance of Naps

Naps lasting 60 to 90 minutes have been shown to boost learning and creative problem-solving by up to 40%.4 Dr. Jandial explains that napping can enhance problem-solving by allowing the brain to enter a state of imaginative and divergent thinking, which is crucial for creativity. He emphasizes that napping isn't a sign of laziness but rather a useful tool for cognitive enhancement, especially if it doesn't disrupt nighttime sleep.

It is essential to pay attention to the stages of sleep entry and sleep exit, the critical moments just before and right after sleep - these are times to harness creativity and insight. Additionally, incorporating naps into your routine can be a game-changer, boosting creativity and problem-solving skills. Dr. Rahul Jandial highlights that these short, restful breaks aren't just for relaxation—they're a powerful tool for enhancing mental agility.

More From Jay Shetty

Listen to the entire On Purpose with Jay Shetty podcast episode on “Dr. Rahul Jandial ON What Your Nightmares Are Trying to Tell You & How to Know Which Dreams You Need to Pay Attention to” now in the iTunes store or on Spotify. For more inspirational stories and messages like this, check out Jay’s website at jayshetty.me.

¹Schredl, Michael & Fricke-Oerkermann, Leonie & Mitschke, Alexander & Wiater, Alfred & Lehmkuhl, Gerd. (2009). Longitudinal Study of Nightmares in Children: Stability and Effect of Emotional Symptoms. Child psychiatry and human development. 40. 439-49. 10.1007/s10578-009-0136-y.  

²Diaconu Ș, Falup-Pecurariu O, Țînț D, Falup-Pecurariu C. REM sleep behaviour disorder in Parkinson's disease (Review). Exp Ther Med. 2021 Aug;22(2):812. doi: 10.3892/etm.2021.10244. Epub 2021 May 28. PMID: 34131435; PMCID: PMC8193212. 

³Adventure-Heart, Denholm & Delfabbro, Paul & Proeve, Michael & Mohr, Philip. (2017). Reality Testing and the Mnemonic Induction of Lucid Dreams: Findings From the National Australian Lucid Dream Induction Study. Dreaming. 27. 206-231. 10.1037/drm0000059. 

⁴Cousins JN, Wong KF, Raghunath BL, Look C, Chee MWL. The long-term memory benefits of a daytime nap compared with cramming. Sleep. 2019 Jan 1;42(1):zsy207. doi: 10.1093/sleep/zsy207. PMID: 30371902; PMCID: PMC6335868.